All in with Manifold
25 09 2006We bought the Universal Edition & a run-time version. It includes a lot of functionality for less than $1,200. I installed it last week but had not really had much of a chance to play around with it, until this weekend.
I read/worked several of the tutorials and just played with it a bit.
I’m going to put it through some test this week & I’ll be commenting on them. I’ll also try to post some side-by-side screenshots to compare to ArcMap.
Why did I get Manifold?
I got it to help us distribute our multi-county mapping project for Central Texas. It seemed like the most cost-efficient method of creating a web mapping service. Arc Server was just too much money for us at this time & the free open source solutions weren’t able to give us the quality of output that we are looking for.
Now, maybe I didn’t put enough time & effort into getting the FOSS solution to work, and maybe the Manifold output will be no better, time will soon tell. Given our limited budget and my limited time, we wanted something that had at least a semi-out of the box solution. I’d rather spend my time tweaking things rather than re-inventing a wheel to my exact specifications.
Our other goal in getting the software was to attempt to use Manifold to publish an OGC map service that could then be fed into ArcGIS Explorer (whenever it is that it finally comes out of private beta). Then we would create customized ArcGIS Explorer tasks & interfaces for clients with varying needs. Those interested in our data for commercial real estate purposes will certainly want to ask different questions to the data than those using it for habitat conservation efforts.
More to come later this week as I dig into this software and see just how much of the Manifold website is hyperbole.
Pardon the intrusion, googled for some research on Manifold and ran across your blog. Believe me, Manifold’s claims may be bombastic but they are true. They will be cleaning up their website soon of all the dated material so read the link below about who they are before they remember it’s there and take it down. Plus there’s no need to go it alone, meet other power users online at the forum site, lots of helpful information and many are incredibly willing to lend a hand with questions and code.
http://exchange.manifold.net/manifold/manuals/r45manual/mfd45hlpAbout_Manifold_System.htm
[...] The reason we bought Manifold was to have a GIS in which to create nice maps of our large datasets in an easy way and serve them out to the web. While there were plenty of warnings that Manifold’s website was full of hyperbole & BS, I choose not to heed them. [...]
Well, this is a pretty good example why Manifold charges for tech support - there is no reason why people who have the common sense to read documentation carefully should be burdened by the cost of providing technical support for people who choose not to read documentation, ignore the advice of the company and then get themselves into wretched chaos that could so easily have been avoided.
Matt appears to have read virtually none of the suggested documentation (as is repeatedly recommended) and now he is bleating about lack of technical support. Jeez!
Let’s consider a few of the particularly off-base comments:
“What I’m NOT OK with is misrepresentations. ”
I think the “misrepresentations” thing is about MrSID. Clearly marked in pride of place on the manifold.net home page is a big link to Formats. One hopes that anyone interested in a particular format will click on that link. Looking up MrSID on that link one finds:
“SID .sid “MrSID” images using LizardTech proprietary format. Requires prior installation of any one of several free import utilities. ”
OK…this is not rocket science: The formats page clearly tells you that working with sids requires an import utility. No “misrepresentations” here. Presumably, anyone interested in MrSID will next seek more detailed discussion. That is conveniently at hand in the very copious and detailed text available online in the User Manual (all 5000 pages of which are reprinted on line so that there is no possibility of anyone having to do without total, complete, detailed information on any aspect of Manifold).
The complete topic on importing MrSID is at
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/import_image_sid_mrsid.htm
which, of course, also includes links to helpful topics like the Compressed Images topic at
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/compressed_images.htm
which *explicitly* provides advice that Matt should have followed. These topics make it clear in a totally over-the-top way just exactly how .sid files should be used, that is, converted to ECW.
No surprises there to anyone who bothers to read the documentation. Anyone can read the URL to the MrSID topic above and see that what I am saying is painfully true. Matt, if there is any “misrepresentation” here it is you who is doing the misrepresentation by failing to note that any confusion you have about MrSID arises entirely from your failure to read the documentation about it. We can put the material there on the web site and in the user manual but if you don’t read it, that’s your fault.
For that matter, if by some imbecilic maneuver you managed not to realize any of that and ordered Manifold by accident despite all Manifold’s efforts to tell you everything possible you might want to know *before* the sale, well, you could have just returned the product using the money-back guarantee! The product is structured the way it is because very large numbers of GIS users like it that way. You don’t have to agree with them. If you don’t like it, no problem - that’s what a 30 day money-back guarantee is for, to assure that in no way possible are there any misunderstandings about what people want.
Let’s now turn to
“In the help file & online manual there are approximately 4 pages devoted to Internet Mapping Services of some kind or another. ”
This is utter foolishness and misrepresentation as well. IMS is an *integral part* of Manifold so everything else that is said in that manual applies. There are thousands of pages of information on a myriad set of capabilities that are part of Manifold and so are part of or can be part of an IMS project. You can’t use IMS without understanding Manifold and only a fool attempts to use sophisticated software of this nature without bothering to read the documentation in the recommended order. Manifold repeatedly advises people not to skip the introductory reading on their way to becoming IMS gods.
Specifically, that recommendation is to read *at least* the topics in the Introduction chapter and also the topics in the Examples chapter. As is noted in the initial “Read Me First” topic at
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/read_me_first.htm
“No matter how smart or experienced you are, the minimum amount of reading required to operate Manifold is to read all the topics in the Introduction chapter followed by reading all of the topics in the Examples chapter.
Even if you have a very simple job to do there is no way to shorten this time or to skip necessary topics. It’s like learning to drive a car: you must learn to operate the steering wheel, the brake, the gas pedal and the transmission or you don’t go anywhere. Just because you want to drive a short distance or because you are under time pressure doesn’t mean you can skip learning about the steering wheel or the brakes.”
Later on that same Read Me First topic also advises:
“Advice from Technical Support: Some topics are so detailed you will be tempted to jump directly into them if they look like what you need to do today under deadline pressure. Resist the temptation. All topics assume you’ve read and understood the foundation material presented in the Introduction and Examples chapters, so other topics do not repeat necessary, but elementary, steps. Jumping into a topic without reading the introductory material in the Introduction and Examples chapters will most likely waste time and cause needless frustration.”
Gee whiz, Matt, they appear to be talking about you! From what you wrote it appears you neglected to read all sorts of important introductory topics. I can’t believe you would have had the difficulties you report had you read topics such as the ever popular “Working with Large Images or Surfaces” topic at:
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/working_with_large_images_or_surfaces.htm
The Performance Tips topic at
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/performance_tips.htm
or heck, dozens of other topics that would have helped.
The Performance Tips topic is especially relevant since there are often many different ways of doing the same thing in Manifold (or, of course, IMS) and it can make a big difference whether you take the time to learn how to do something in an expert, efficient way or whether you don’t bother to read the many tips and points of advice provided and end up doing things very ineptly and slowly.
Also to quote from that topic:
“People are sometimes amused that we include the user as part of our performance tips. However, the greatest gains in performance are usually achieved by using a better method or algorithm. More often than not the sole factor in whether a better method is used is the expertise and clarity of mind that can be mustered by the user. A healthy, well-rested, expert user is the best performance accelerator around.”
So true!
One last thing… getting back to your comment:
“”In the help file & online manual there are approximately 4 pages devoted to Internet Mapping Services of some kind or another. ”
… the bit about 4 pages is utter nonsense. Even if you neglect the many, many other pages that describe Manifold features and functions used within IMS, even so there are six (count ‘em) very serious topics explicitly devoted to IMS:
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/map_server_overview.htm
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/creating_a_web_site.htm
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/ims_config_txt_options.htm
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/ims_queries.htm
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/publishing_multiple_pages.htm
http://www.manifold.net/doc/7x/optimizing_performance.htm
… together with seventeen (count ‘em, seventeen!) fully-formed tutorial examples on the Free Stuff page (which users are advised to consult in the first of the above topics). The above URLs also include many links to useful topics and contain many points which your blog entries appear to indicate you did not bother to read.
For example, in the Optimizing Performance topic cited above there is an explicit note that had you followed it would have assured you “blistering hot performance” indeed instead of the minutes-long delays you reported:
“Use Compressed Images - Using a linked image with an ECW or JPEG 2000 file is vastly faster than ordinary images, a difference of virtually instantaneous zooming and panning as opposed to possibly minutes for very large images.”
Hey! Look at that! The topic even uses “minutes” just like you complained about! - I know plenty of people who operate image servers using 20+ GB ECWs on machines that are real turkeys (older generation PCs with limited memory) who do indeed get instantaneous response. I myself have used very large ECWs and continue to be amazed at the instantaneous response even when using very large files.
Look, you’re entitled to your opinion, but people are also entitled to judge you as a lightweight if you commit the cardinal technology sin of mucking about with serious, sophisticated software without bothering to read the instructions. When you thrash about without having bothered to follow directions your blog entries don’t provide much guidance to serious people except as evidence that you don’t have the technical maturity to take the advice of more experienced colleagues seriously (namely, the advice from tech support in the Read Me First topic).
Manifold is an incredibly rich and powerful program. You can indeed do a vast range of things in it. But just like Visual Studio or any other serious environment very little of that is available beyond the trivial level to people who are unwilling to invest the time required to learn the package in the recommended order.
It’s been often remarked that “Manifold is software for grown-ups.” Part of being a grown up is understanding that you do indeed have to read the instructions to operate complex things. Grown ups know that if they don’t have the time to do something they’ve taken on it is not realistic to expect someone else to do it for them for free.
So, if you are a grown up about these things you *like* the idea that your cost of Manifold is the cost of a license unburdened by tech support costs because you don’t want to spend your hard earned cash on expensive services you don’t need. Grown ups *expect* to have to pay a fair price for consulting and education if they are unwilling or unable to read and educate themselves.
Ultimately, manifold.net makes no judgement calls on this: if you want tech support, no problem: you can pay for it and at a darn low rate at that ($49 per incident in a ten pack to consult with expert, world-class developers on development matters is darn cheap). And, if you don’t need tech support and can leverage free resources like reading the user manual or participating in online user forums, no problem. You’ll be glad no one is going to take money from you for something you don’t need.
In a nutshell, Matt, if someone takes on a bigtime IMS project and doesn’t bother to read the documentation as recommended they are not remotely as likely to get the results they want as someone who does. Surely, every person experienced in technology would expect that.
But if you take on a project without following the advice in the documentation that’s not manifold’s fault, it’s the guy who took on a serious project without the maturity to learn how to do it right using the tool at hand. I’m sorry you didn’t follow the advice offered, but anyone who’s read those links I cite can see that if you failed to do so it was despite Manifold’s best efforts to advise you. As they say, “you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make him drink.”
Regards to all,
Dimitri
(a Manifold guy)